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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 10:54 pm 
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Hi guys,

I'm renovating a property to live in that is a semi detached house nextdoor to my Mum, it's on a shared supply in a rural location so I can't put a separate supply in.

The mains to my mums is I think half inch copper,(my father changed his side from lead a couple of decades ago) which then goes into my house, it was lead from the yard boundary into my house (about 10m) but I've just dug it up and put some 25mm MDPE from the half inch into my house.

The problem I have is that I tested the pressure and it's 3 bar but as soon I my mum turned her kitchen water tap on it went down to 2 bar and when the bathroom tap was on as well it went down to 1 bar and seemed to reduce to nothing after they was both on for a while. So I can only think that if my mum was in her house and had a washing machine and a shower on then I wouldn't be able to run anything in my house?

My mum has a hot water tank and cold water tank in the Bungalow up stairs with a oil boiler , condensing I think?

My dilemma is what type of system to use? My plumbing knowledge is basic so I'm trying to get a descent idea before getting the pro's in, I have this idea that I could have both a cold and hot water tank downstairs in my utility room with pumps artificially maintaining hot and cold pressure.

Is something like that possible?


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:53 am 
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You need to search for 'water accumulator'

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:00 am 
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You have two choices. Either an accumulator as Dave says or cisterns. Personally I'd probably just go for a conventional system with a large cistern in the loft which could be pumped if you need more flow. I'd put all the hot and cold outlets except for the cold to the kitchen sink, basin in bathroom and outside tap on the stored water side.

If you're on oil I wouldn't say a combi was the most efficient solution

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:00 am 
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Thanks for the replies both, I really appreciate the help!

Gas4you - have you had much experience with the accumulators? How do you rate them?

Razor - any reason for going with a cistern over an accumulator? And any reason for not going for a combi on oil? I was thinking about the combi route for simplicity but I don't have the knowledge to really make a good judgment call


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 3:01 pm 
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Also have a look at the Salamander HomeBoost pump. It used to be the case that fitting any sort of pump to a mains supply wasn't permitted, but specialised pumps like this one that will provide 12L/min (and automatically disengage if the incoming supply exceeds that) are fair game. Never fitted one, but they certainly look worthy of consideration.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:13 pm 
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I've had a little look at the salamander units, can't say I really know that much about them, I'll have to ask on here to see if anyone has had any real world experience with them.

How would they work if my mum is using the taps? Do they just pull more through the half inch main? Could it starve my mums house?

I'm getting 14l per min without anyone else using anything FYI.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 5:38 pm 
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Griff84 wrote:
I've had a little look at the salamander units, can't say I really know that much about them, I'll have to ask on here to see if anyone has had any real world experience with them.

How would they work if my mum is using the taps? Do they just pull more through the half inch main? Could it starve my mums house?

Yes - the pump would need to go on the supply side to support both buildings, or assuming you pay separate rates or have separate water meters, one pump serving each property. In instances of poor flow (<12L/min) it would ensure the break tanks fill as quickly as the supply allows.
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I'm getting 14l per min without anyone else using anything FYI.

Ah, in that case forget it. The pump will add nothing if you have a consistent supply of >12L/min.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:08 pm 
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The trouble with using a Homeboost pump is if you did manage to boost yours next door wouldn't get any water whilst it was running!!

There are times they work well - usually I would use one on the gravity outlet of a cistern to give decent pressure at the taps but not suitable here.

An accumulator works on the principle of compressing air. Imagine a big cylinder that has a rubber membrane stretched across it halfway down. The water main goes in the bottom and the top has air in it.
When the water comes in the bottom mains pressure forces it in. This makes the rubber membrane deform upwards and the air above it compresses. Then when you open a tap the mains water pressure drops but the stored energy air as it expands keeps the pressure at the same level until the air is back at normal pressure. So basically you get mains pressure water for longer. The doenside is the size. To get a 150 litre boost you'll need a 300l accumulator.

Your last two options are to go for either a conventional setup with cisterns in the loft and a hot water cylinder or go pretty much with your original idea of a large cistern with a booster pump - this is known as a break tank set up. You only need one pump and take both the hot and cold feeds off the outlet of this.

As always the kitchen cold tap must be off the main to comply with the regs!

Not having a combi is a personal choice for me in this scenario purely because oilers tend to be quite inefficient and a combi version will not modulate down to a low enough output for the heating, oil is only gonna get more expensive!!

Now if you had gas that would be a different story :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:40 pm 
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Excellent info Everyone!

How much is 150l worth so to speak Razor? Could it fill a bath then have someone have a shower after that? I have a 1 year old daughter and will probably have more children in future so I gotta get this right as it could cause a fair few issue down the road if I mess it up!

I can't say I understand the last comment about modulating down to to low out put? But I'll get googling lol my mums oils works ok though?

I was going to go for oil for the convenience really, big tank and twice a year refills and it's sorted but someone in my work is getting gas so I'll have to chew his ear off about it? What's the benifits of gas in your opinion??


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:58 pm 
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Razor wrote:
The trouble with using a Homeboost pump is if you did manage to boost yours next door wouldn't get any water whilst it was running!!

This is a bit academic, I know, as he's said he's already getting 14L/min, but a mains pump on the branch for each of the properties would deliver up to 12L/min to each house. Technically speaking, with the pumps in each house running simultaneously, it would be drawing up to 24L/min along the shared supply pipe, but if the houses are separately metered (or have separate rates) then I think it's not a problem as long as the pumps are fitted downstream of the stopcock for each house.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:07 pm 
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We don't have a meter for with property we pay a set amount every year for the water, they renewed the 9 inch mains about 15 years ago but never put a meter in, probably because it would be impossible to calculate the separate amounts we use through the one main


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:30 pm 
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Aye. But if you pay separate rates for each property, then you can have a mains pump in each (well... as far as I'm aware, anyway).

We have a shared water supply here too -- Victorian-era lead main into my neighbours property, then 15mm through the party wall from his house into ours. We're not on a water meter, but when he got one fitted next door, they had to fit two -- one on the main supply from the street and a second one in his house just before the pipe disappears through the wall into ours. He has to deduct our reading from the main one every time he pays the bill! It's all a bit of a mess, TBH!

One day I'll dig a trench and lay some MDPE so he can have the lead pipe to himself. It's mainly the hassle of having to deal with the water board to get it inspected and connected up that puts me off to be honest!

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:32 pm 
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No I have never fitted one so have no real world experience to speak of.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2017 2:26 pm 
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Thanks for all your help guys top work, a lot more research is needed! Lol


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