Need advice about buying drill

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dm71
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Need advice about buying drill

Post by dm71 » Sun May 12, 2019 5:23 pm

I've been using my Dremel 3000 to drill holes in wood and it works fine for that but unfortunately the countersink bit I bought the other day won't fit in the chuck. It fits in my Bosch cordless screwdriver but that doesn't have enough torque to drill anything. So I need to buy a drill and would be grateful for some advice to make sure I get a decent one.

Apart from drilling screw holes in 18-38mm wood, in the near future I'll also need to drill holes in my concrete ceiling, plaster over brick outer walls and plaster over breeze block internal walls for 4mm diameter 60mm long screws to secure soundproofing clips like these https://www.soundproofingstore.co.uk/is ... r-ceilings.

I know that brushless motors are better for various reasons and in that category I've found this Dewalt combi with 70nm max torque, two 2A batteries, charger and case for £150:
https://www.toolstation.com/dewalt-dcd7 ... ill/p30986

or this Einhill combi with 60nm max torque, two 2A batteries, charger and case for £90:
https://www.wickes.co.uk/Einhell-Power- ... l/p/207752

At the budget end I've found this brushed Hilka with only one battery and a 89-piece accessory set for £30. However even if it doesn't fall apart after a couple of years, it only has 20nm max torque which I imagine is too low to be of much use.
https://www.robertdyas.co.uk/pro-craft- ... essory-kit

Are any of the above worth getting or is there something else that you'd recommend instead?
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by London mike 61 » Sun May 12, 2019 6:20 pm

If you have got concrete ceilings to drill into then I would buy a sds drill for the job because they will make drilling a lot of holes a piece of cake. https://www.screwfix.com/p/titan-ttb277 ... 230v/99935
As for drilling into brick and block then this would have enough punch to do the job https://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-dcd77 ... rill/899cf

I’m only a DIY’ er but I’ve got drills similar to these and they have done everything I wanted with ease.

Mike
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by fin » Sun May 12, 2019 7:33 pm

the dewalt drill will be decent.

go to screwfix they do a dewalt sds drill for drilling the masonary for £199 with 2 batteries. comine it with that dewalt drill and youll not gan wrong like
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by dm71 » Sun May 12, 2019 8:48 pm

London mike 61 wrote:If you have got concrete ceilings to drill into then I would buy a sds drill for the job because they will make drilling a lot of holes a piece of cake. https://www.screwfix.com/p/titan-ttb277 ... 230v/99935
As for drilling into brick and block then this would have enough punch to do the job https://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-dcd77 ... rill/899cf

I’m only a DIY’ er but I’ve got drills similar to these and they have done everything I wanted with ease.

Mike
Thanks. I'll probably just got a Combi drill for now and get the SDS drill when I'm ready to do the ceiling.

Comparing that Dewalt DCD776D2T combi from Screwfix with the DCD796 one from Toolstation it's £30 cheaper with the following differences -

Max Torque: 42Nm vs 70Nm
No Load Speed: 0-450 / 1500 rpm vs 0-550/2000rpm
Impact Rate: 0-7650 / 25,500 bpm vs 0-9350/34,000bpm
Capacity Masonry / Steel / Wood: 13 mm / 13 mm / 30 mm vs 13mm / 13mm / 40mm

I don't really have any understanding of what those numbers mean in practice but I wonder if it might be worth paying the extra £30 for the more powerful drill? Can you think of any situation where it would make a significant difference? Also, what do the Capacity figures refer to, it can't be the depth it can drill to as 13mm is barely anything?
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by big-all » Sun May 12, 2019 8:49 pm

i note the dewalt dcd796 is a toolstation special not available in general with no wattage output that is a good guide to the engine output
https://products.dewalt.co.uk/powertool ... rchy/3148/
i assume its the pedisessor to the 797 which isnt overly powefull as drills go but powerfull enough and would be my choice off off those
https://products.dewalt.co.uk/powertool ... DCD797D2B/
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by rooster4321 » Sun May 12, 2019 9:49 pm

13 mm refers to the keyless chuck size the diameter of the drill bit that would accept approximately half inch

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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by dm71 » Sun May 12, 2019 10:36 pm

fin wrote:the dewalt drill will be decent.

go to screwfix they do a dewalt sds drill for drilling the masonary for £199 with 2 batteries. comine it with that dewalt drill and youll not gan wrong like
Thanks. I can see how a cordless SDS would be more convenient for drilling the holes in my ceilings than a corded one but that's a bit much for me to spend when I'll probably never use it again, so I might look at renting one instead.
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by dm71 » Sun May 12, 2019 10:49 pm

big-all wrote:i note the dewalt dcd796 is a toolstation special not available in general with no wattage output that is a good guide to the engine output
https://products.dewalt.co.uk/powertool ... rchy/3148/
i assume its the pedisessor to the 797 which isnt overly powefull as drills go but powerfull enough and would be my choice off off those
https://products.dewalt.co.uk/powertool ... DCD797D2B/
They seem to have much the same specs (max torque, no load speed, beats per minute) so I imagine they're the same wattage but it does seem a bit strange that dewalt don't list that model on their own site.
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by wine~o » Mon May 13, 2019 6:19 pm

I bought a Hitachi (now Hikoki) from screwfix 5 years ago and was able to drill several 25mm holes through a double skin wall (brick/gap/breeze block) not quite like a knife through butter but worked. That was with 1.5Ah batteries. Currently same drill @ £159.99
with 2 x 5Ah batts

https://www.screwfix.com/p/hikoki-dv18d ... rill/934fj
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dm71
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by dm71 » Mon May 13, 2019 7:59 pm

wine~o wrote:I bought a Hitachi (now Hikoki) from screwfix 5 years ago and was able to drill several 25mm holes through a double skin wall (brick/gap/breeze block) not quite like a knife through butter but worked. That was with 1.5Ah batteries. Currently same drill @ £159.99
with 2 x 5Ah batts

https://www.screwfix.com/p/hikoki-dv18d ... rill/934fj
Thanks, that seems like a pretty good deal for 2 x 5Ah batteries.

I went to my local Toolstation today intending to buy the Dewalt but despite their website showing they had 1 in stock, after checking they found the wrong drill was in the case! There's a couple of other stores fairly local that have several in stock but they're a lot more inconvenient for me to get to so I may just get that one from Screwfix (which is actually next door to the Toolstation I went to today).
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by Job and Knock » Tue May 14, 2019 3:29 pm

TBH as a tradesman I feel that I can justify having a cordless SDS drill - my main toolkit these days is pretty much all cordless because it sidesteps the issue of PAT testing (a 3-monthly requirement on corded tools used on site) as well as freeing me from the need to carry around and maintain multiple 110 volt cables and a gurt great heavy transformer. At home, however, I have no such constraints and were I buying tools for use at home I'd be seriously considering corded stuff simply because it is so much cheaper.

For drilling into ceilings weight becomes a factor very, very quickly. Trying to heft a 4kg Titan SDS above shoulder height is, I'm afraid, an exercise in both futility and probably strained muscles. If you are doing a lot of drilling into concrete ceilings (and I'm speaking from the experience of having netted-out more than a few ceilings in the past) you quickly find that some form of dust extraction becomes an absolute must unless you enjoy grit and dust constantly coming down into your face and eyes, even when you are wearing goggles and a dust mask. If I add the clip-on DX01 dust extractor to my own cordless SDS (a Makita DHR242) the weight and bulk make that fairly uncomfortable to use above shoulder height for any time as well - as a battery tool it already starts out about 600 to 800gm heavier than a corded tool when the battery is installed. I'd suggest that to do the ceiling task the OP would be better off looking at something like a 2kg class corded SDS (such as a Bosch blue GBH2-24. Makita, Hikoko/Hitachi or the like) combined with a cheap vacuum, a pre-filter cyclone extractor (because concrete dust would otherwise go straight through a vacuum cleaner filter unless it is class M rated)
Pre-Filter Cyclone 001_01.jpg
Pre-Filter Cyclone 001_01.jpg (42.25 KiB) Viewed 381 times
and home-made/cheap drop box plus an adaptor such as this from Karcher:
Karcher NT Dust Extraction Adaptor 001_01.jpg
Karcher NT Dust Extraction Adaptor 001_01.jpg (28.35 KiB) Viewed 381 times
or this one by Makita:
Malkita SDS Dust Extraction Adaptor 001_01.jpg
Malkita SDS Dust Extraction Adaptor 001_01.jpg (21 KiB) Viewed 381 times
to catch the dust at source where the drill exits the ceiling. Others are available. BTW it should be possible to source a decent SDS drill at £75 to £120 if you look around
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by fin » Tue May 14, 2019 5:20 pm

j&k where does that cyclone thing come from? could probs do with something to go with my festool extractors to save on bags. and not festools effort at over £300 last rtime i checked ha
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by Job and Knock » Tue May 14, 2019 9:17 pm

There are loads of them on both Amazon and eBay, Fin. I just Googled "amazon dust pre-cyclone" then followed links to get this and this as a starting point on Amazon - in eBay I searched for "wood dust cyclone" which gave me this page

Happy browsing!
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by ahfix » Wed May 15, 2019 8:45 am

I looked at the dust cyclones too but you need a large bucket to mount it plus time to put it together.

I ended up getting a Triton Dust Bucket which does the same thing as the cyclone but in one unit. You can get them in screwfix https://www.screwfix.com/p/triton-dust- ... 3ltr/3754r

or Amazon https://www.amazon.co.uk/Triton-DCA300- ... 184&sr=1-3

One down side with the Triton is that the filter which is intended to protect the vacuum motor clogs and needs cleaned. As long as you have a bag or filter on your vacuum motor then I think it's safe to remove the filter on the bucket.

ah
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Re: Need advice about buying drill

Post by dm71 » Wed May 15, 2019 12:03 pm

Job and Knock wrote:For drilling into ceilings weight becomes a factor very, very quickly. Trying to heft a 4kg Titan SDS above shoulder height is, I'm afraid, an exercise in both futility and probably strained muscles. If you are doing a lot of drilling into concrete ceilings (and I'm speaking from the experience of having netted-out more than a few ceilings in the past) you quickly find that some form of dust extraction becomes an absolute must unless you enjoy grit and dust constantly coming down into your face and eyes, even when you are wearing goggles and a dust mask. If I add the clip-on DX01 dust extractor to my own cordless SDS (a Makita DHR242) the weight and bulk make that fairly uncomfortable to use above shoulder height for any time as well - as a battery tool it already starts out about 600 to 800gm heavier than a corded tool when the battery is installed. I'd suggest that to do the ceiling task the OP would be better off looking at something like a 2kg class corded SDS (such as a Bosch blue GBH2-24. Makita, Hikoko/Hitachi or the like) combined with a cheap vacuum, a pre-filter cyclone extractor (because concrete dust would otherwise go straight through a vacuum cleaner filter unless it is class M rated)
Thanks for the advice. It hadn't occurred to me that the extra weight of a cordless SDS and a dust extractor clipped on the side would cause difficulties when drilling the ceiling. I'll look for a lighter corded SDS and pre-filter cyclone extractor instead.
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