Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

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Kev888
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Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Kev888 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:09 am

Just starting to get to grips with waste transfer notes; they're more involved than I expected!

One issue is the SIC code. I'd thought these were just used by companies, but the guidance on waste transfer seems to imply they're required from any businesses, which would include sole traders like myself.

It would be easy enough to put one on in any case, but... I can't actually find one that seems very suitable. Maintenance and repair of property, appliances & gardens, small amounts of construction etc; all the codes seem too limited and specialist to cover what a handyman does.

Does anyone know what is acceptible?

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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Job and Knock » Mon Aug 06, 2018 4:52 pm

Surely maintenence and repair of property - which must cover a "multitude of sins"
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Kev888 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:53 pm

Thanks, yes that would make a lot of sense, but for the life of me i can't find such an option in the SIC codes.. Maintenance of boats, vehicles etc yes, but for some reason not property; strange.

Perhaps in the absence of an accurate one, it should be "96090 - Other service activities not elsewhere classified". But looking at companies house, the most popular code handymen use seems to be "43390 Other building completion and finishing". To me that sounds like it should be about new builds, but perhaps there is safety in numbers.
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by darrenba » Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:26 pm

Who are you creating the Waste Transfer Notes for?

When I tip my waste, the waste company supply me with a waste transfer note/receipt.
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Kev888 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:54 pm

At the mo I'm just trying to work out what I may need to know for when the time comes, but it will be one of the local waste processing sites that I'm taking it to (or in some cases a carrier like a skip or grab company will take it from me). I have only just got a licence to carry waste, so this is new to me.

Am I right in thinking it is okay to do the paperwork once you get to the waste company, i.e. when it is transferred it to their care, or does it need to be done in advance of the journey to transfer it to them?
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by darrenba » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:00 pm

I don't give them any notes, they just provide me with a note/receipt when I tip. As long as you've got your licence details, that's all that they normally require.
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Kev888 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:31 pm

Thanks, thats great. As its now my living and I've got a van (rather than a car) it seemed worth getting clued up. but probably I'm over-thinking it again!
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by chrrris » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:01 pm

I think, strictly speaking, you're supposed to provide a waste transfer note to the customer (so that they can uphold their position that the waste was lawfully disposed of to a licenced carrier if it ends up in a farmers field or dumped by the side of the road or whatever). I've never been asked for one though. Mind you, I rarely dispose of my own waste -- it's usually Hippo bags or a local "man and van" disposal, or skips for larger jobs. My van is full of nice shiny things like my tools, etc. I don't have a vehicle I'd be happy dumping somebody's old bog, basin and bath in.

I don't know what it's like in other areas, but anything metal (old washing machines, dishwashers, cooker hoods, copper pipework, etc) I just leave outside the customer's house with a sign saying "Scrap. Please take" on it. Lucky if lasts an hour round here! The scrap metal fairies take it every time.
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Kev888 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:57 pm

Thanks; yes it does seem a bit like you can take it in different ways. I gather that if I generate the waste, then it could reasonably be considered mine from the outset - as it wasn't waste when the customer owned it. But then, if they want to dispose of the waste themselves it would be more convenient if they owned it..

Similarly, if I arrange for a skip, its just a transfer from me of the wast I generated to the skip company. But.. if the skip is used by the customer and/or for taking away existing waste then technically it has either been transferred to me, or I'm a broker!

I guess it will mostly be skips or hippo bags, or else the customer disposing of their own waste. I've only a small van so big waste is out, and I've nowhere to store up rubbish so the minimum charges make small stuff uneconomic too. The things I'll be taking are probably just what won't go in their bin but don't warrant a bigger collection.
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by wobs » Tue Aug 07, 2018 8:27 am

SIC code for Building maintenance and restoration domestic buildings - 41202
SIC code for Building maintenance and restoration commercial buildings - 41201

SIC code is dictated by the activity that generated the waste, which is bizarre when you have a site that has one process, but generates wastes by different activities, so if you disposed of fluorescent tubes from a factory that processes say oil, it would come under a code for electrical work. This is silly, as it doesn't tell you anything useful, as the EWC code will already describe the waste. It would be more useful to have a single SIC code for a site, so you could see if a particular sector generated more of a type of waste (eg. so you could see where asbestos was coming from, or fluorescent tubes).

I recommend downloading the spreadsheet for 2007 SIC codes, which covers both hazardous and non-hazardous waste:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/methodology/clas ... /uksic2007
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Kev888 » Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:06 am

Thanks; I'd wondered about 41202. It is a pity it doesn't say property rather than buildings, to encompass the grounds/gardens of the property too, but you're right, it is probably the closest I'm going to get.

As you say, it all seems a slightly bizarre, and not even very meaningful on the waste transfer form. TBH I assumed such things weren't even relevant to sole traders until it came up there. But probably it doesn't carry much weight because of that, so any reasonable code may do just as well in this case.
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Re: Waste transfer note; handyman SIC?

Post by Kev888 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:02 pm

chrrris wrote:I think, strictly speaking, you're supposed to provide a waste transfer note to the customer
I've done some more poking around, and this is certainly so if I were to collect/take any of their waste :thumbright: It would also apply if the waste I generated technically remained their responsibility (e.g. their wall just becomes their rubble). But annoyingly, I can't be sure if that is always the case, never the case, or whether it depends (on contract terms or similar).

Some guides would seem to class me as the waste's 'producer', with inherent duty of care for it to begin with. So no transfer and in theory* no transfer note needed 'if' that is true. But it'd have other implications instead - e.g. if I left waste with the customer to dispose of and it got dumped in a field and proven, then it would be me failing to show duty of care! Or if it was collected by a service, it would be me (not the customer) who might have to show the waste was transferred to them.

All quite tedious stuff. But as ignorance of the law is no defence, I wish it were easier to find out. Think I'm going to have to contact some official types to do that.

--------------

*except I've also seen it implied that moving the waste just physically off the site without a transfer note is an offence (in which case I'd be both transferor and transferee!) :?
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