Pricing tips

Painting and decorating, plaster mouldings, Artexing questions

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
wine~o
Senior Member
Posts: 24819
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:49 pm
Location: hants/dorset border
Has thanked: 1329 times
Been thanked: 3657 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by wine~o » Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:24 pm

Or your customers???
Verwood Handyman

Verwood Handyman


___________________________________________________________________

If you feel you have benefited from the Free advice given on the Forum, Please consider making a donation to UHM's Nominated charity, read all about it and donate here :

http://www.donnasdreamhouse.co.uk
transitboy
Senior Member
Posts: 3576
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 6:39 pm
Has thanked: 379 times
Been thanked: 583 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by transitboy » Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:27 pm

When i am going to look at a new job to price .I always take my shoes of before entering their house.just shows you respect there property and I must admit i have had some good feedback saying our impress they were and it shows when I go back to start the job .I will be respect there house and wont abuse it
User avatar
paintycait
Senior Member
Posts: 1457
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 11:12 pm
Location: Scotland
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 107 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by paintycait » Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:40 pm

wine~o wrote:Or your customers???
???
Skilled Artisans are not cheap....Cheap artisans are not skilled.
http://www.decoratescotland.com
http://decoratescotland.blogspot.com/
User avatar
wine~o
Senior Member
Posts: 24819
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:49 pm
Location: hants/dorset border
Has thanked: 1329 times
Been thanked: 3657 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by wine~o » Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:45 pm

paintycait wrote:
wine~o wrote:Or your customers???
???

Doesn't work without your quote (Bottom of page 1)

If you found that in your area you were losing biz by asking for a deposit it might be worth changing your policy.

hence "Or your customers???"

Hope this makes some sense...
Verwood Handyman

Verwood Handyman


___________________________________________________________________

If you feel you have benefited from the Free advice given on the Forum, Please consider making a donation to UHM's Nominated charity, read all about it and donate here :

http://www.donnasdreamhouse.co.uk
jozeffo
Senior Member
Posts: 2451
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:52 pm
Location: South London
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 272 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by jozeffo » Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:47 pm

I think that if I felt the need to ask for a deposit, I wouldn't trust the customer enough to do the work at all. Having said that, I used to be a debt collector and have never been very small or very pretty.
User avatar
paintycait
Senior Member
Posts: 1457
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 11:12 pm
Location: Scotland
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 107 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by paintycait » Sat Mar 05, 2011 9:39 pm

Wine~o now I understand cheers
jozeffo wrote:I think that if I felt the need to ask for a deposit, I wouldn't trust the customer enough to do the work at all. Having said that, I used to be a debt collector and have never been very small or very pretty.
I am sure you are a bonny lad really

My point is not about trust per se...........the client is asking that you invest time now, purchase materials and time in your diary to be set aside for them. Unlike merchandise if someone wastes your time you can never get money again for it....if they cancel and if you are then unable to make that time work for you in other ways, you have lost the time forever. If you asked a lawyer, estate agent, dentist, to physically set aside a specific part of their diary...let's say 3 days... specifically for you and you cancelled that 2 days before due date...do you think honestly that they would let you off without billing you?
Skilled Artisans are not cheap....Cheap artisans are not skilled.
http://www.decoratescotland.com
http://decoratescotland.blogspot.com/
jozeffo
Senior Member
Posts: 2451
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:52 pm
Location: South London
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 272 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by jozeffo » Sat Mar 05, 2011 9:58 pm

PC, your business suits that model of deposits etc and you are absolutely right about commercial customers being more risky. On large commercial contracts, I have taken deposits because they have been written into the terms of trade of the customer.

I never travel far for work because I live within an hour of about ten million people. Equally, people can be wary of deposits here because we have a transient population. I often suggest materials are on site before I start, but if I were to charge a deposit and I was late finishing the job before, what would happen then? It often does because I can be a little optimistic!?

I have had cancellations because people have either sold or rented the property, but they have always been apologetic and have called me next time they need work doing.
User avatar
paintycait
Senior Member
Posts: 1457
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 11:12 pm
Location: Scotland
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 107 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by paintycait » Sat Mar 05, 2011 10:29 pm

My business model is no differnt than many on here but a lot of what I do involves investing more time than maybe the average tradesman in advance of the project so maybe I am a little focused on that element.
My point is that if you DON'T ask for a deposit you need to think about how you would handle this situation. Now this is all dependant on what you do before you arrive on site. You said
"I often suggest materials are on site before I start"
I would no more want my client buying materials than I would want to paint with a floor brush.....I want to be able to supply the correct product for the job and I don't want a client deciding that B&Q's special this month is what they think I should paint with and I also want to use my trade discounts to improve the profitability of my business. That's only good business sense.
"if I were to charge a deposit and I was late finishing the job before, what would happen then? It often does because I can be a little optimistic!?"
You call the client as soon as you are aware of the discrepancy in timing and let them know or you get a sub in to help you meet deadlines

This thread is about pricing and when pricing, these are all elements of how you work out the price of the job...how you place yourself in the market. Don't get me wrong, I have made some HUGE mistakes regarding this in the past and it is why I am a little vehemant about stressing the point.

If you have worked out that the market will not bear x but that your business may have to bear y and that you have done q to counteract this possibility...then GREAT...but I am just throwing it all out there as the variables to be considered
These users thanked the author paintycait for the post:
Colour Republic
Rating: 7.14%
Skilled Artisans are not cheap....Cheap artisans are not skilled.
http://www.decoratescotland.com
http://decoratescotland.blogspot.com/
User avatar
54aardvark
Senior Member
Posts: 1322
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 5:53 pm
Location: MONTROSE
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 56 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by 54aardvark » Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:26 pm

Last year I started asking 20% up front from new clients when I realised quite how much I was clattering the business overdraft even before the job started - none of them has even queried it. Old and trusted clients I'll stretch to £100 of materials, any more or specialist stuff that I won't use elsewhere, and I'll take a deposit.

If the job is going to last more than a couple of weeks I will tie in stage payments.

Its a commitment from both parties - I am confident that they are committed to the job, they are confident that I have planned out the job correctly and I have an obligation to complete it to their (and my) satisfaction.
There are no problems - only solutions
upagumtree
Senior Member
Posts: 2028
Joined: Sun Feb 20, 2011 4:35 pm
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 253 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by upagumtree » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:01 pm

Just want to clarify my point about customers buying materials.

This will normally apply to mixed paint, (should it be wrong its down to them).

I will specify the brand and quality.
jozeffo
Senior Member
Posts: 2451
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:52 pm
Location: South London
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 272 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by jozeffo » Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:36 pm

My aussie friend, you are absolutely right, wallpaper and mixed paint I prefer to leave down to the customer because it transfers the risk to them. I sometimes go with them to pick it up or have even let them put it on my account if I am busy.

I wouldn't want them to buy the sundries and the PBW because I usually have them in stock or I know what is on deal and where. B&Q had dulux trade vinyl matt on for £ 27 for 10L recently so I bought a few because I know brewers will always be more than that. Usually I will use Covaplus because it is cheaper on bonanza week at Johnstones, as many on here will know. I bought the dulux for a change because so many on here will only use dulux trade and I like to know which I prefer, although I am not sure I could tell the difference having done a few ceilings last week.
User avatar
bobbie-dazzler
Senior Member
Posts: 3857
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 6:14 pm
Location: Greater london
Has thanked: 54 times
Been thanked: 87 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by bobbie-dazzler » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:54 pm

jozeffo wrote:I don't like to ask for a deposit because I think it makes the customer feel more secure if they are dealing with someone who has the resources to pay for the materials.
I dont either, but if its like a 2 week plus job then I will say something, I like to get a few days in before I even ask for a draw.
I would rather want something I dont have, that have something I dont want
User avatar
Colour Republic
Senior Member
Posts: 3372
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:08 am
Location: Brighton & Hove
Has thanked: 263 times
Been thanked: 544 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by Colour Republic » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:12 pm

Always set out a payment plan before works start that is fair to both parties.

I have to agree with almost everything PC has said as it mirrors pretty much what we do.

jozeffo wrote:My aussie friend, you are absolutely right, wallpaper and mixed paint I prefer to leave down to the customer because it transfers the risk to them. I sometimes go with them to pick it up or have even let them put it on my account if I am busy.
This is the difference through Jozeffo, It depends on the sort of clients you are working with, what they expect and how much hand holding is needed.

We have clients in all price ranges but most are instructing us because of not only the physical installation of products but also the design element of it.

You can of course let your customer choose the colours and wallpaper without any input and that's fine but we prefer to offer our services in helping them choose or supply design from a very short brief, the client can be involved as little or as much as they like. Is it risky? No not at all, you are charging for a premium service which has cost related to it and the customer understands this. Yes you run a small risk of designing something that the customer dislikes that you may well have to sort out at your expense but if you have listened to your customer you will deliver a design that exceeds their expectations.

Only in very exceptional circumstances would I ever get a customer to pick up materials as that again is a service we provide as absolute minimum. Maybe you let them do the running around in order to be able to give them a cheaper price and that's cool, if it works for you then who can argue but it's a very different business model to our own.
jozeffo
Senior Member
Posts: 2451
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:52 pm
Location: South London
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 272 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by jozeffo » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:45 pm

CR, I never choose the colours for my clients because I am a little bit on the colour blind side and most of them are female and choosing the colours and paper is the part of the process that they enjoy most of all.

I also find that if they choose the colours, they often go for something expensive such as Sanderson or Farrow and Ball. That can eat into my profit if I am paying for the colours.
User avatar
Tom d'Angler
Senior Member
Posts: 3537
Joined: Thu May 21, 2009 6:18 am
Has thanked: 813 times
Been thanked: 429 times

Re: Pricing tips

Post by Tom d'Angler » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:33 pm

I also find that if they choose the colours, they often go for something expensive such as Sanderson or Farrow and Ball. That can eat into my profit if I am paying for the colours.
Surely you charge them the actual price of the paint, not the same price no mater what brand the paint is?
Locked

Return to “Painting & Decorating Forum”