Mastic used for wall ties

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Jaytee73
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Jaytee73 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:53 am

I have had a wall tie contractor come to my property to give me a quote for replacement wall ties.

I was advised on what the replacement procedure is and he advised me that once the wall ties were replaced, the holes would be filled/sealed with a red mastic.

This colour mastic will be noticeable and I just wondered if there are any alternative colours that are used.

Also, the contractor said that the existing wall ties would not be removed and would just be left there and I wondered if this is usually the case; possible corrosion issues? as he said the new ones will be non-corrosive stainless steel. I'd been advised by someone else that these old wall ties would remain within the brick but that they would need isolating.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

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ahfix
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by ahfix » Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:28 pm

Sounds like a con.

How can they prove the wall ties need replaced? What is wrong with them?

Wall ties are suppose to be bedded into the mortar between brick courses, to make them secure. How do they plan to do that on the inner leaf? If they are not secure they are doing nothing and a waste of money.

When was your house built?

ah
Chippo1
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Chippo1 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:33 pm

Ooooo this sounds like a good money making scheme !

Seems that your house is falling down , the outer skin of the cavity falling away from the inner cavity, how was it determined that the existing ties need to be replaced ?

I would be inclined to ask the contractor if they like travel and sex.
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APDIY
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by APDIY » Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:20 pm

As per your very recent question on this matter:

It smacks of:
"We've just finished this job for one of your neighbours and we've over-ordered the tarmac/wall ties/external wall paint/matching roof tiles/double glazed uPVC windows/turf/......."
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Chippo1
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Chippo1 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 5:53 pm

Just mentioned this to a friend who’s a surveyor and former building control officer , he nearly fell on the floor never had a problem with wall ties other than the odd wall, or section of where they weren’t installed.

He said , and I agree if you are no confident , don’t do anything until you get independent advice from a surveyor or such like.

Do these guys have x ray eyes ?
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Jaytee73 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:48 pm

Hi,

Sorry, I didn't mention this in my initial post:

The Contractor had been round previously with the scope/detector and he said it showed that replacements were needed; the house was built in approximately 1955 and so around 65 years old.

He had previously drilled into the mortar/brick on his previous visit and had filled it with this red coloured mastic.

I had been reading up about wall ties and he never mentioned anything about isolating the old existing ones; I asked him about this and he said that they are just left in the wall.

The other thing was the mastic to fill in after the ties have been installed; it was this red colour and he said this is the only option, whereas I've seen that sand/cement can be used to match it to the colour of brick more or less the same.

The cost of the work quoted to me is £900.00 which seems very reasonable in comparison to other prices but then is it too reasonable because the level of work is not as thorough as other people's?

Furthermore, he wanted this second meeting to advise me that whilst very unlikely, he had to mention the minute possibility that there could be cracking on the internal wall when he drills through.
Chippo1
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Chippo1 » Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:04 am

Said it before get a second opinion !
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Rorschach » Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:11 am

Why did you have someone round to look? Are you having problems?

As others have said definitely get a second opinion from an independent surveyor.
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Jaytee73 » Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:48 pm

Rorschach wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:11 am
Why did you have someone round to look? Are you having problems?

As others have said definitely get a second opinion from an independent surveyor.
I had someone round as I've recently bought the house and the Surveyor advised me that the wall ties should be checked.
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by cotswold builders » Sat Feb 15, 2020 5:14 pm

Your Surveyor was right to inform you to get them checked.
Very common problem with older properties using metal ties.
To answer a few questions, the cavity and ties can be inspected very easily by drilling only a 10mm hole and use a borescope, I carry one in my van all the time to check unseen problems like this.
There are several methods of replacing ties, Mechanical expansion ties, Resin/grouted method, or more easier method is the helical system.
These are fitted by drilling into both walls, the helical is fitted by drilling slightly undersized bit and then screw fitted using a special adaptor on a drill, cutting its own thread similar to fitting thunder bolts.

They are drilled through the brick, hence the red mastic, but they should be able to tone down using cementone.
Some inner walls are concrete section hence you cant go through joints, about 50 local authority houses a couple of miles from me have recently been done using the helical system, on HAs Hawsley SGS systems.
The existing ties are not removed but isolated by means of Clan Sleeve, Rockwool or builders foam.
Some ties rust more than others, the most common were fishtail ties.
It seems your wall tie firm know what they are talking about, the should have an S/E on board and tell you the method of works, taking into account that the helical ties are a pound each the price sounds good.
Chippo you need to educate your surveyor friend, wall tie failure is common knowledge
ahfix
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by ahfix » Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:31 am

Great points cots.

There was/is a scam where cold calling 'wall tie' firms needlessly con people into work.

The questions posted on the how and whats were for the op to ensure they know what to ask. Would also have been useful if the Op stated a surveyor was involved.

Out of interest why isolate the old ties? What is the affect of leaving them.in place.

ah
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by Chippo1 » Sun Feb 16, 2020 10:20 am

He said it’s very rare ! Not a common issue , sufficient to say he has never seen it, other than where a builder for got to fit them or insufficient.

Would the reason for isolation of ties that are corroding , the corroded steel expands, this is the case with “Regents Street Disease” which affects old steel frame buildings that are clad in masonry, as in Regents Street.
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Mastic used for wall ties

Post by cotswold builders » Sun Feb 16, 2020 1:34 pm

Its a lot easier leaving the old ties in place,as they only need the outer wall joint cut around it, meaning its now isolated from the outer wall, the its either sleeved or foamed back in.
Removal would need the removal of a brick, then either extracted or cut of as near to inner wall as possible.
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