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 Post subject: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:02 pm 
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Had our dining room painted in "Crown Vinyl Matt"
lounge in "Dulux Trade Vinyl Matt"
kids room in "Dulux Trade Diamond Matt"

Note - We have 2 small kids

Dining Room (crown vinyl matt) - There seems to be no way to wipe stains, it completely ruins the finish and touch up's are incredibly noticable. i.e in 2 weeks we had a mark and the whole wall will need to be repainted.
Lounge (Dulux vinyl matt) - Greasy hand print - Bit of water and soft tissue several times does eventually remove stain ,but creates a bit of sheen damage.
Kids room - Stains can be removed with water + soft tissue, but paint does come off on tissue, although damage does not appear noticeable.


What is the best paint to use to over paint these rooms?

1.)
Dining room: - I see Crown do "Clean Extreme Matt + Egg shell"
A) Is the Eggshell any stronger against stains
B) Is it harder to touch up the eggshell?
C) What is the best paint to use in a dining room with 2 small kids touching walls (that's already been painted in Crown Vinyl Matt)

2.)
Lounge: Dulux have a "Diamond" + "Diamond Eggshell + High Performance Eggshell
A) What would be the best to use in a living room, I believe the "eggshells" are meant to be better at withstanding marks and staines, but is it going to look horrendously reflective ?
B) Any other suggestions?

3.) Kids room ("Dulux Trade Diamond Matt")
Is there something stronger I can put down, i.e will the high performance eggshell prevent any paint being lifted, does it come with a consequence as the Flat matt does look nice.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 7:38 pm 
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The crown trade srubbable Matt is very good, I recommend that one highly.
It's good for stains but scuffs are a pain for most paints.

The best one for scuffs I'm aware off is Benjammin Moore Scuff-x and it does what it says on the tin.
It's aimed at commercial premises but I know lots of decries are using it in houses.

Another option is a Matt emulsion with a couple of coats of polyurethane Matt varnish.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:45 pm 
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Most Acrylic based matt emulsions, will give you the durability you require. I would advise Acrylic Eggshell in higher traffic areas that are constantly getting marked, it is far superior, and much easier to clean.

I work in PPG Technical (Johnstones & Leyland) so I would advise the following:

Johnstone's Cleanable Matt ---------- 1-5% SHEEN LEVEL
Johnstone's Acrylic Durable Matt ------ 5-6% SHEEN LEVEL
Johnstone's Acrylic Durable Eggshell -- 17-22% SHEEN LEVEL
Leyland Trade Hardwearing Matt ----- 5-6% SHEEN LEVEL
Leyland Trade Hardwearing Eggshell -- 20% SHEEN LEVEL

The Dulux Diamond should not come away on your tissue, and I can only assume one of the below points:
- The paint had not fully cured - we advise 7- 10 days before you scrub the paint
- There was not enough film build ( lack of coats)
- The cleaning solution was too harsh - we advise a non bleach detergent - we prefer sugar soap and a magic sponge, followed by a rinse with clean water.

Water is not sufficient to clean stains- especially grease, all you are doing is moving it around, and applying more pressure than is needed, creating a burnish mark. A detergent is required.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:25 pm 
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jmt wrote:
Most Acrylic based matt emulsions, will give you the durability you require. I would advise Acrylic Eggshell in higher traffic areas that are constantly getting marked, it is far superior, and much easier to clean.

I work in PPG Technical (Johnstones & Leyland) so I would advise the following:

Johnstone's Cleanable Matt ---------- 1-5% SHEEN LEVEL
Johnstone's Acrylic Durable Matt ------ 5-6% SHEEN LEVEL
Johnstone's Acrylic Durable Eggshell -- 17-22% SHEEN LEVEL
Leyland Trade Hardwearing Matt ----- 5-6% SHEEN LEVEL
Leyland Trade Hardwearing Eggshell -- 20% SHEEN LEVEL

The Dulux Diamond should not come away on your tissue, and I can only assume one of the below points:
- The paint had not fully cured - we advise 7- 10 days before you scrub the paint
- There was not enough film build ( lack of coats)
- The cleaning solution was too harsh - we advise a non bleach detergent - we prefer sugar soap and a magic sponge, followed by a rinse with clean water.

Water is not sufficient to clean stains- especially grease, all you are doing is moving it around, and applying more pressure than is needed, creating a burnish mark. A detergent is required.


We would like to keep the existing colours and changing the manufacturer and colour may also require more prep, Do you believe Johnstone's products are noticeably superior to the Crown Extreme egg shell or Dulux High performance eggshell.
After 8 weeks of painting there is already several marks, as you probably already know it's near on impossible to keep kids hands constantly clean and not touch the wall. I am looking for something that we can wipe clean without damaging the paint. Ideally this would still be manufacturer by crown or dulux product and any experience of these is welcome, if the consensus is that these products are inferior we may well have to look at changing colours.

If sticking to Crown + Dulux, it sounds like your opinion would be to do all rooms in the "Crown Extreme - Egg shell" - hardest of the crowns and "Dulux Diamond Trade - high performance eggshell - hardest wearing of the Dulux offering? Rather than the Trade Matt's ? I'd rather not have high sheen, but I much prefer this than not being able to clean the wall :)

FYI - The kids room was painted in Diamond Trade Matt, this was done by decorators, at least 3 coats were applied. Forgetting the water, even a soft tissue and lightly rubbing the paint will put yellow on the tissue! This was painted in October. We will probably have to get this repainted in an eggshell if it's more resiliant.

Cleaning Wise. The magic sponge definitely pulls paint off the vinyl matt surfaces we have (i tried 4 rooms), same with anything but being very delicate with water and slowly breaking it down. I want to make sure that when this gets repainted we have done sufficient research in to getting something that looks good and is kid proof! :)


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:30 pm 
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Eggshell would look shocking everywhere.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:26 pm 
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Desmondo15 wrote:
Eggshell would look shocking everywhere.


What would you suggest?


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:12 pm 
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Matt and live with it, eggshell is a bit too shiny compared to matt although it varies between manufacturers. You have young children, they will grow up, you talk like having a new car and refusing to drive it because it will get dirty. Also, if you change manufacturers, get the nearest colour to what you have so it is not a drastic change. In any case, repainting - esp. if using the harder wearing paints - you should be looking at two coats so a small colour change should not be a problem as far as painting goes.

Just my 2 pennies worth.

PS. If you look at the trade paints of Crown, Dulux, Johnstones (in alphabetic order) at the trade shops, colours get mixed on the spot, unlike DIY shops that they have a number of different colours ready. When mixing the choice of colours is wider to try and match what you have and that is before you get into "matching" services.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:30 pm 
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Tikkurila optiva 5


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 6:57 pm 
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digga2 wrote:
Desmondo15 wrote:
Eggshell would look shocking everywhere.


What would you suggest?


Read my reply if you like.....


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:28 pm 
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I've not had a problem with a magic sponge lifting colour off a wall before, as long as it is used properly i.e. no detergent or cleaner of any kind (just hold the sponge under the running cold tap and then squeeze out as much of the water as you physically can) and be as light-handed as possible when using it.

I have used magic sponges for years with great success and no damage to the painted surface, old or newly painted. I even used one to remove a black scuff mark from wallpaper that had I had hung just the day before. It removed the mark and didn't damage the surface of the paper at all.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:24 pm 
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Tom d'Angler wrote:
I've not had a problem with a magic sponge lifting colour off a wall before, as long as it is used properly i.e. no detergent or cleaner of any kind (just hold the sponge under the running cold tap and then squeeze out as much of the water as you physically can) and be as light-handed as possible when using it.

I have used magic sponges for years with great success and no damage to the painted surface, old or newly painted. I even used one to remove a black scuff mark from wallpaper that had I had hung just the day before. It removed the mark and didn't damage the surface of the paper at all.



Yes, we love the magic sponge. We use it on all the woodwork and wall papered rooms.
Unfortunately on the crown and dulux "vinyl matt" it pulls the paint off and causes discolouration. Incidentally it does the same on the "kids room", which was done in the diamond range. But I usually use washing up liquid on a sponge and then wiping off, this seems to remove less of the paint, although takes about 30 passes to remove a mark.

We use the JML Doktor sponge (https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01 ... UTF8&psc=1)
Just wet it, squeeze out and very lightly go over the stain. Are you sure you have used it on vinyl matt? I am more than willing to try another magic sponge if yours works on the vinyl matt and can give it a test and report back.

Think we will go for the Crown - scrubbable matt in the living room and "diamond vinyl matt" in the living room and just see how long it lasts.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:42 pm 
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Quote:
Are you sure you have used it on vinyl matt?


Yes. Every room in our house is in VM. We have two rugby-playing sons and a dog, all careering up and down the stairs, often making marks as they go! A magic sponge, if used correctly, removes the marks without having a detrimental effect on the paint. Not using too much pressure and using the sponge without any added chemicals is the key.


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 Post subject: Re: Scrubbable Paint
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:43 pm 
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Magic sponge ??? I thought that was what what they used on footballers in the 1970's ???

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