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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 1:49 am 
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Hi guys.

I might already know the answer to this but thought would be worth picking ppl's brains before taking any action. Feel free to point out any errors I make below preferably without multiples of these ???

I'm working on two properties with Marley Deepflow (coincidentally) installed in early 80s despite one property being very old and one less than 40 years old.

The old building has 1, maybe 2, drips coming from the gutter and I've been up to investigate and find that whoever notched the gutter at that union 34 years ago did it so badly that there is no compression in the joint and it leaks badly.

On the more modern building the customer is saying all her seals are leaking but when I had a look I found the gutters were so full of leaves etc they were overflowing and full of water. I scooped out a bagfull of vegetation and the water started flowing away quickly but not completely as (typically) the downpipe outlet is higher than sections of the guttering. She wasn't pleased when I said the seals seemed ok. IE there were no drips visible and that was with some water still standing in the gutters .

Anyway back to the point of this thread. New unions aren't expensive so it's tempting to replace them but as the original guttering has been notched it's likely that the new unions won't grip well on the old guttering as the clips may well coincide with the notches.

If this is the case would be as well putting new gutters and unions on.

However it might be worth trying new seals in the old unions but I didn't remove one to compare with a new Deepflow seal.

Anyone know if they are the same/similar?

Image
old property had Marley Deepflow fitted in early 80s. has bad leak from union at LHS due to excessive notching

Image
unions on older Marley Deepflow quite different to current range


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 12:23 am 
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Ok. Despite no replies at all to this thread I'll keep posting as it has at least had some views (399). Must admit I thought it would generate some response as Marley Deepflow isn't exactly obscure :dunno:

So I went back to the customer today with 2 universal Marley seals I got online for approx £6 posted. There are 8 in total on her front gutter but I didn't see point in buying that many if they weren't going to work. I didn't actually expect them to as nothing that is universal ever works but I can't find the old type seals anywhere so had no other option.

Customer says gutters aren't overflowing any more since I cleaned them but still dripping from two of the joints. So I had to choose which joint to try them in. When I got up the ladder I found that one of the unions is actually the more modern type so the seals are correct for that but what we really want to do is see if they work in the old type unions.

So I took the old one off and cleaned up the various silicone/mastic repairs it had had over the years then tried to re-assemble with the new seals but there was no way it would clip back together with the gutter.

I put it down to the thickness of the new type seal and decided just to put the old flat ones in properly. The joint still wouldn't go back together. This 10 minute job was turning into over an hour. The customer kept helpfully pointing this out despite fact I told her I wasn't charging her as I couldn't be sure it would work.

On close inspection it was because the notches in the gutter and union were out of synch so the strap couldn't fit. That explained why the lady's (now deceased) husband had mastic'd the strap on. He didn't install the gutters but the builders had done it so poorly that this was his workaround. Basically the strap/clip was only on at the back and was stuck to outside face of the gutter but not offering any compression. The other side of the union was similar. So I modified the notches on the gutter and the straps are now on properly albeit a very tight fit.

I then stuck the new seals in the more modern union.

Told the lady to wait till next heavy rain and if no improvement new gutters/unions to be fitted


Image
Marley Deepflow union - but not as we now know it. modern ones have no notches in them


Image
dimensions and name are same as modern one but part no. RUD1 is now RUD10


Image
wide seals and strap/clip on old ones. modern type don't have separate strap. clips are integral with joint


Image
can't get any of these seals


Image
but you can get these - listed as being for Marley Deepflow. no I don't think so either...


So, going back to the original aim today, could I have fitted the new seals to the old union and would they have worked? Possibly if I'd made the notches deeper but after spending a couple of hours faffing about with it all I wasn't going to take it apart and try again


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:17 pm 
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From my recollection the gutter size is the same. So just fit a new union onto the gutter in notched.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:00 pm 
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The gutter is the same size but new union might not work as has fixed clips and if they land at same place as the old straps will be at the notch on the gutter - so no compression.

Basically will need to replace unions and gutters. That's what my point was at the start:

Anyway back to the point of this thread. New unions aren't expensive so it's tempting to replace them but as the original guttering has been notched it's likely that the new unions won't grip well on the old guttering as the clips may well coincide with the notches.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:13 pm 
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The gutter was notched at every fitting, where as the new system is notchless. You can use/connect to the old gutter, with new fittings & no requirement to notch.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:52 am 
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Dickie wrote:
The gutter was notched at every fitting, where as the new system is notchless. You can use/connect to the old gutter, with new fittings & no requirement to notch.


I know there's no requirement to notch. My issue is you can't get rid of the notches on the old gutter. If you put a new union on old gutter you won't get any compression if the clip on the new union is over the notch on the old gutter


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 8:07 pm 
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Why not buy some of this sheet material & use it on the unions?
https://shop.deltarubber.co.uk/black-ep ... CUQAvD_BwE

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donnas-dream-house-charity-t52110.html
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For this message the author Dickie has received gratitude : foy9999
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 9:21 pm 
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Cheers. That is an option I guess


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