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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 2:57 pm 
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Hi all

I've just moved into a house and am decorating a room. I unscrewed the sockets to decorate, and noticed that the earth wires are not connected to where the earth part of the socket (where the earth prong from the plug goes in), but rather to the pattress box. Just wanted to check whether this is normal or not. It's an old house and nothing everything has been done to spec!

On another note, on two of the sockets some wires were loose. I had to push them fully in and then tighten the little screws. Not good! The sockets had been working, but was still not best pleased to find that and am thinking now to go around the whole house and check them all. But I'm curious to know when an electrical safety check on the house would have picked this up or not. I'm presuming not but ain't sure.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:21 pm 
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I would imagine that the earthing would have been 'adequate', because socket faceplates have metal around the screwholes and therefore earth back to the backbox through the mounting screws. The recognised "belt & braces" approach is to take the incoming earth to the socket, with a flylead back to the inner box terminal.

No, I doubt that it would show up on a test, because there would still have been a connection.

As for loose screws, this is one of the reasons why *any* screwed connections (chockblocks, those round junction boxes, etc.) must be accessible for checking, only positive locking connectors such as Wagos (other makes are available) may be hidden. And yes, you ought to check all accessible sockets, switches & junction boxes.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:25 pm 
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The earth wires should go to the earth terminal on the socket.
What ever is plugged in could still be earthed as the faceplate screws will go into the back box and in 99% of sockets the fixing screw positions are connected to earth. But best practice is to connect the earth to the socket, then a fly lead to the back box.

I would suggest you check all of the sockets in view of what you have found. Electricity off while you do it.

When an EICR is done what you have found should have been rectified, but often some electricians will do an EICR from their vehicle :shock:

I type too slow :oops:

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Working on anything electrical? have you got a multi meter? why not? Would you hit a nail with a shoe?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:37 pm 
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someone-else wrote:
I type too slow :oops:


No, you start too late! :salute:


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:51 pm 
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arco_iris wrote:
No, you start too late! :salute:


No, I really do type too slow. I started way before you posted (Judging by the "posted" times) but you were done and dusted and posted while I was still typing. :wink:
Your post came to light just as I pressed submit, it then said another post has been made prior to yours......(meaning my post not YOURS)

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Which is correct? Metre or Meter? Click the link to find out more.

Working on anything electrical? have you got a multi meter? why not? Would you hit a nail with a shoe?

If gloom had a voice, it would be me. :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:32 pm 
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someone-else wrote:

When an EICR is done what you have found should have been rectified, but often some electricians will do an EICR from their vehicle :shock:



Good ones have a look through the letterbox.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:40 pm 
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arco_iris wrote:
I would imagine that the earthing would have been 'adequate', because socket faceplates have metal around the screwholes and therefore earth back to the backbox through the mounting screws. The recognised "belt & braces" approach is to take the incoming earth to the socket, with a flylead back to the inner box terminal.

No, I doubt that it would show up on a test, because there would still have been a connection.

As for loose screws, this is one of the reasons why *any* screwed connections (chockblocks, those round junction boxes, etc.) must be accessible for checking, only positive locking connectors such as Wagos (other makes are available) may be hidden. And yes, you ought to check all accessible sockets, switches & junction boxes.



When doing an EICR you state what percentage of accessories were removed for inspection. Now if I was to say remove 5 or 6 sockets and found a socket made off like that I would be recommending that ALL sockets were inspected. This is of course further expense (unless you DIY it) but is the only way to do the job properly.

Loose terminals often show up when doing end to end readings on a ring.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:36 pm 
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OnlyMe wrote:
Loose terminals often show up when doing end to end readings on a ring.


As I was "quoted" by our resident expert, may I just say, in my defence, that I meant that the "earth to the backbox" (and thence the faceplate earthing through the securing screws) would not show up as these connections were apparently secure, and referred to OP's first paragraph.

OP's second paragraph then opened "on another note", regarding the loose screw terminals.

Cheers!


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 6:27 pm 
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arco_iris wrote:
OnlyMe wrote:
Loose terminals often show up when doing end to end readings on a ring.


As I was "quoted" by our resident expert, may I just say, in my defence, that I meant that the "earth to the backbox" (and thence the faceplate earthing through the securing screws) would not show up as these connections were apparently secure, and referred to OP's first paragraph.

OP's second paragraph then opened "on another note", regarding the loose screw terminals.

Cheers!


Either way, the "earths" should as you said go to the socket not the backbox with a flylead from the socket to the backbox.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 3:43 pm 
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Hi all

Many thanks for the helpful replies. I'm going to go round the house and check all the sockets and light switches myself. Before doing so though, I wondered if I could clarify a couple of things and ask some more questions...

1. So where ever I find the same, I need to remove the earth from its current position and re-attach to the socket?

2. At the same time, I then put a fly lead into THE SAME earth socket connector and attach the other end to the back box.

3. If so, what do I need for the fly lead? And I presume I sleeve it?

4. As a DIYer, is there anything else I need to be aware of in doing all this? Obviously I now know to check for lose connections whilst in there! :)

5. Some of the sockets in the house do not have switches? Should I install these at the same time and if so is it good practice or a requirement?

6. If the house ends up needing a rewire, I guess all of this will need redoing anyway will it? So should I wait? A lot of the wiring in the house is not chased in and I've had a few floor boards up and can see the wiring there too. I've no idea why or when a house needs a rewire. I'll do some reading on that now, but any information in the meantime would be great.

Sorry for all the questions and thanks again for all the help.

PS - I also have a question regarding phone chargers in our house, but will save that for another post which I'll write now.

Cheers


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