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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 8:03 pm 
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I'm thinking of adding a heating element to a towel rail via a dual fuel retrofit.

Plumbing is easy enough, but I'm unsure about the electrical connection.

Element comes with a 1.5m flex which I'd fit into an unswitched spur mounted near the bottom of the rad. Spur I want to either have as a timer switch, again, down low, or mounted towards the top of the rad with the cable feeding down the inside of the wall. Timer will be fed from the ring final which is already RCD protected.

All this is in a bathroom, outside zone 2, and in Scotland so any mention of Part P will be tutted at.

Hints, tips, advice and tutting please.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 9:30 pm 
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what is it you want to know? you seem to have a good "plan" (although I would put the timer in an adaptable box, to keep it clean and free from prying fingers and sweeping brooms)

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:14 pm 
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someone-else wrote:
what is it you want to know? you seem to have a good "plan" (although I would put the timer in an adaptable box, to keep it clean and free from prying fingers and sweeping brooms)


There's always a big difference between thinking through what parts to buy and the practicality/legality/safety of fitting them so it's always good to get a second opinion.

Timer switch at spur level? Bad idea? Good idea? I'm assuming a timer rated as IPX4 is safe enough. Might be typing through a hole in my thingy though.

Had read somewhere ages ago something about all switches and timers had to be outside of a bathroom, but I can't remember which country they were referring to.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:24 am 
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AlwaysLearning wrote:
Timer switch at spur level? Bad idea? Good idea? I'm assuming a timer rated as IPX4 is safe enough. Might be typing through a hole in my thingy though.

Had read somewhere ages ago something about all switches and timers had to be outside of a bathroom, but I can't remember which country they were referring to.


I am not a sparky.

I have had similar questions also in Scotland (in my case I will not bother with an electric element). For very simple guidelines see https://www.falkirk.gov.uk/services/pla ... 1406020913

If it is easy to pass the cable through, I would have everything (switch/timer) outside the bathroom (which I would have done for me but it was easy enough to cable under the floor). Where isolator switches are fitted to fans connected to lights they are supposed to be high up and out of normal reach (I would think the same would apply to anything electrical that someone can touch).

If it helps a little.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:47 pm 
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Well I would say that the heater should be double pole switched, you can also buy a timer switched fuse spur eg https://www.screwfix.com/p/gv/7643g and have the timer and fuse in the same unit.

As for location then outside zone 2 is allowed.

And the rest of the electrics in the bathroom, are all circuits RCD protected or do you have supplementary bonding?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:09 pm 
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Good spot for the fused timer switched spur.

When you say the heater should be double pole switched, would that be a separate isolator or would the timer switch spur suffice if I found a double pole one?

As for your question, the RCD protection is at the consumer unit.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:24 pm 
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AlwaysLearning wrote:
Good spot for the fused timer switched spur.

When you say the heater should be double pole switched, would that be a separate isolator or would the timer switch spur suffice if I found a double pole one?

As for your question, the RCD protection is at the consumer unit.


The timer I linked to has double pole switching.

You said the ring was RCD protected, what about the other electrical circuits in the bathroom, eg lights.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:39 pm 
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OnlyMe wrote:

You said the ring was RCD protected, what about the other electrical circuits in the bathroom, eg lights.


Well all the circuits have MCBs and the split CU has RCD protection at the switches. Does that count or is additional protection needed for the heater?

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:31 pm 
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There is no need for further RCDs as long as all the circuits in the bathroom are 30mA RCD protected.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:23 am 
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I found a problem when central heating is switched off, but water still warm that thermo-syphon can continue to circulate the water.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 2:53 pm 
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ericmark wrote:
I found a problem when central heating is switched off, but water still warm that thermo-syphon can continue to circulate the water.


Surely solved by closing off one of the rad valves?

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2018 12:02 am 
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OnlyMe wrote:
There is no need for further RCDs as long as all the circuits in the bathroom are 30mA RCD protected.


Is there a requirement for a further isolator switch eg above the door as is usual for isolating extractor fans?

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2018 7:03 pm 
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AlwaysLearning wrote:
OnlyMe wrote:
There is no need for further RCDs as long as all the circuits in the bathroom are 30mA RCD protected.


Is there a requirement for a further isolator switch eg above the door as is usual for isolating extractor fans?


No. Mind you there is no requirement that says a fan isolator needs to be above a door!!!!


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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2018 11:55 pm 
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OnlyMe wrote:
AlwaysLearning wrote:
OnlyMe wrote:
There is no need for further RCDs as long as all the circuits in the bathroom are 30mA RCD protected.


Is there a requirement for a further isolator switch eg above the door as is usual for isolating extractor fans?


No. Mind you there is no requirement that says a fan isolator needs to be above a door!!!!


I know, but it seems to be where most are fitted, I assume because it minimises chasing out.

I've seen them fitted my the light switch a few times, and they looked out of place to me.

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