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roylec
Junior Member
Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 9
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 Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 9:04 pm Post subject: DSM Mist Coat before Farrow & Ball? |
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I've had four rooms skimmed - Hallway, Lounge and 2 Bedrooms. Nice job, good spreader.
The plaster is about a week dry, there were a few small patches that were bonded first, probably about 15mm deep max.
I need to get started with the painting and would normally mist first with a 5:1 ratio of trade high opacity matt, like Dulux Supermatt (DSM), or perhaps the newer Fast Matt (never tried this so probably won't on this job).
The walls will be finished using a nice Farrow & Ball matt colour, a cream if you are interested..
Anyway, I heard stories that DSM is as sh*te under another paint as it is over the top of another paint. This doesn't make any sense to me, since DSM is only sh*te over another paint because it's meant to be applied to a bare surface like plaster - it shouldn't affect anything painted over the top. But F&B paints are expensive and I don't want to spoil it, so I thought I would offer it out for your opinion.
What do you think?
P.S. It may be that the chap who told me this is alluding to the traditional technique of misting using only the paint that you finish with. This method goes back before we had vinyl paint, so I've no idea if anyone still uses this rule today. |
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Welsh Decorator
Senior Member
Joined: 29 Sep 2007
Posts: 4063
Location: Cheshire
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| Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:21 am Post subject: |
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roylec, welcome to the mad house!...... only kidding!  
Supermatt is very good stuff, ignor what you have been told, it's crap!
You could probably use the F&B thinned as your first coat, as the wall have only been skimmed, not full coated, personaly I would go for a 25 to 30% thin, if you use the F&B as a mist, otherwise, 50/50 non vinyl as a mist coat, but given it's only been re-skimmed, F&B first and finall coats, I've never had any problems at all in the past doing this with F&B paints.
Must admit, I have never had any had any trouble with Super matt, under or over existing paints, Flatt matt is the doggies under carrage as a finish paint, what is your mate on about?   |
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fordy
Member
Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 79
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:49 am Post subject: |
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why use f&b as a mist coat? Its bloody expensive
If its new plaster your gonna need 3 coats anyway!!
Mist with the glidden vinyl matt cheap and cheerful or supermatt whatever takes your fancy. watererd down of course |
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paintycait
Senior Member
Joined: 21 Nov 2005
Posts: 300
Location: Scotland
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:01 am Post subject: |
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Fordy..what are you talking about? you don't mist new plaster with vinyl...
Paint - including F&B...which BTW is not that expensive - is still the cheapest decorative product per sq metre for any surface anywhere in your whole house.
Phone F&B and ask them what they recommend then your back is covered. F&B is very expensive if it fails and you have to paint it all again at your own expense.
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bobbie-dazzler
Senior Member
Joined: 26 Oct 2007
Posts: 1533
Location: Greater london
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:03 am Post subject: |
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| paintycait wrote: |
Fordy..what are you talking about? you don't mist new plaster with vinyl...
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I always mist new plaster with a contract matt, like gliddens or supermat, even if its skimmed, but loads of decorators argue with me that its okay to use a thinned Vinyl as a mist coat also.
Admittidly I did use it once, and it turned out okay, but I still would rather mist with a contract, there are so many different theories about it,its no wonder DIYers get confused.
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handyman
Senior Member
Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 2863
Location: Alderley Edge, Cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:54 am Post subject: |
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most of my painting jobs a F&B at the moment 
Anyway, always use supermatt as the mist coat, and havent have any probs. Doing a few repaints now (2 years later) and these rooms have no problems that i can see.
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handyman
Senior Member
Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 2863
Location: Alderley Edge, Cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:56 am Post subject: |
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ps, a F&B shop have now opened in Wilmslow..........so I'm going to be using even more of the stuff
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paintycait
Senior Member
Joined: 21 Nov 2005
Posts: 300
Location: Scotland
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 8:21 am Post subject: |
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Sorry Bobbie that was said slightly tongue in cheek, lot of controversy there. I would be lary of using cheap vinyl though.
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feva
Senior Member
Joined: 20 Oct 2007
Posts: 621
Location: middlesbrough
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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i use gliddens contract for my mist coat, ive never used vinyl matt for a mist coat, 'if it broke why fix it'
ive never heard of any one using vinyl matt as a mist coat till now |
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handyman
Senior Member
Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 2863
Location: Alderley Edge, Cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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it say on the tubs of vinyl that you can mist coat with it. I found it kind of sat on top of the surface, and when dry, it scrapped off with your nail.
With non vinyl, it seems to sink into plaster much more, and passes the 'nail' test.
Did it once, never again. On the other hand, the paint hasnt failed, and that job must have been 3 years ago
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Welsh Decorator
Senior Member
Joined: 29 Sep 2007
Posts: 4063
Location: Cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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It's the viynl content thats the trouble.
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Kernel32
BANNED
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
Posts: 70
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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A mist coat, is a mist coat.
The problems arise when the plaster isnt dry. |
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handyman
Senior Member
Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 2863
Location: Alderley Edge, Cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Kernel32 wrote: |
A mist coat, is a mist coat.
The problems arise when the plaster isnt dry. |
and theres a whole new topic on the wording on the supermatt tub.................'still drying plaster'
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Welsh Decorator
Senior Member
Joined: 29 Sep 2007
Posts: 4063
Location: Cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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I don't know where the confusion over this comes from
If the plaster is new, or un painted, then a non viynl mist coat is used, if it is still drying out, but not obviously wet, again, a non viynl paint, that is what it was desigend for, if it's paperd, then a glue size is used.
Where does it say (anywhere) about the use of PVA, for anything that stuff started out life as a woodworking adhesive :!: sure it is used for certain jobs in plastering, but never in painting, or paper hanging.
I would really love to know just when this 'super, cure all' became a part of the decorators standard kit
The times that people say 'do I need to PVA first', if I had my way PVA would be sent to room 101. 
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handyman
Senior Member
Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 2863
Location: Alderley Edge, Cheshire
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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well wd, as i said, theres confusion with sealing new plaster when dulux trade vinyl says to seal new plaster with it watered down 20%
Explain that one
http://www.icipaints.co.uk/products/info/dulux_trade_vinyl_matt.jsp
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Last edited by handyman on Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:21 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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