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www.ultimatehandyman.co.uk Forum Index -> Plumbing Forum
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tango
Member
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 82
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 Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 4:41 pm Post subject: Changing old Radiators for new - Heat output |
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The central heating was installed in this house in 1971, the radiators are HUGE and they are not convector(?) rads, they are single with no fins at the back 
What i'm trying to find out is what size new rad will give out the same heat as old
The rad in the livingroom is 2300 x 600mm, how much smaller could I go with a modern rad and still get the same output in heat?
Is there a chart that someone could link me to please?
Thanks |
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thescruff
Senior Member
Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 4658
Location: Bath
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| Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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The old 2300 x 600 was approximately 4500 btus, a Stelrad 800 x 600 K2 elite will give you 4853btus, the compact 4728 btus
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Scruff |
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tango
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Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 82
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 9:14 am Post subject: |
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| thescruff wrote: |
| The old 2300 x 600 was approximately 4500 btus, a Stelrad 800 x 600 K2 elite will give you 4853btus, the compact 4728 btus |
JEEZ! so a modern rad a third of the size of these old rads will give out more heat!
Thankyou Scruff |
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thescruff
Senior Member
Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 4658
Location: Bath
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:08 am Post subject: |
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The K2 is a double panel radiator
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Scruff |
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tango
Member
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 82
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:59 am Post subject: |
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| thescruff wrote: |
| The K2 is a double panel radiator |
OK Thanks, looking at screwfix, a single panel 600x1200 gives out more heat than the old, still a huge difference in size
Now wondering wether to go single or double?
Thanks for your help |
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Hoovie
Devon DIYer
Joined: 27 Jul 2007
Posts: 7773
Location: East Devon
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 11:17 am Post subject: |
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Hi Tango
Double will be noticably deeper off the wall, so the pipework will also have to come out a little bit more, but as you are changing sizes, you'll have to rejig the pipes anyway.
FYI, I bought a rad from Screwfix and some rads from Toolstation - both modern style double panels - and the Screwfix rad was visibly deeper then the Toolstation one - about an inch thicker even with same offset from the wall, and difference was actually evident - so much so I will not get more rads from Screwfix but from Toolstation instead.
thescruff, question for you which fits in this post I think ....
IF you don't have a need to save space in a room where the rad is, and the the heat output from it is ok, is there any reason apart from asthetics to replace?
I am presuming that an old rad may not be as efficient in transferring heat to a room, but there is no actual heat wasted?
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thescruff
Senior Member
Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 4658
Location: Bath
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 11:29 am Post subject: |
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| tango wrote: |
| thescruff wrote: |
| The K2 is a double panel radiator |
OK Thanks, looking at screwfix, a single panel 600x1200 gives out more heat than the old, still a huge difference in size
Now wondering wether to go single or double?
Thanks for your help |
Be carefull with Screwfix, they calculate at 70c not 65c so the rad output looks better than is.
A 1200 K1 single panel with fins 4094 btus.
A 1400 ditto with with fins 4777 btus.
Personally if a single fits nicely under a window, I would prefer it, with doubles on plain walls in corners with limit space etc.
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thescruff
Senior Member
Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 4658
Location: Bath
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| Hoovie wrote: |
Hi Tango
thescruff, question for you which fits in this post I think ....
IF you don't have a need to save space in a room where the rad is, and the the heat output from it is ok, is there any reason apart from asthetics to replace?
I am presuming that an old rad may not be as efficient in transferring heat to a room, but there is no actual heat wasted? |
Its the fins that boost the output, so an old rad without would be considerably larger than a modern one with.
Technically a rad can be as large as you like, as the TRVs control the room temperature, the only consideration to that would be system volume and expansion.
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Scruff |
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Hoovie
Devon DIYer
Joined: 27 Jul 2007
Posts: 7773
Location: East Devon
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 11:42 am Post subject: |
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| thescruff wrote: |
Technically a rad can be as large as you like, as the TRVs control the room temperature, the only consideration to that would be system volume and expansion. |
Thanks - got an ugly old rad with no fins in my office, but that in itself not a good enough reason to change then (it is also holding my desk up   )
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If you have a son, DO NOT name him after a verb ....
"Neil, Standup. Neil, Standup"
"Which is it, man?" |
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tango
Member
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 82
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Hoovie wrote: |
Hi Tango
Double will be noticably deeper off the wall, so the pipework will also have to come out a little bit more, but as you are changing sizes, you'll have to rejig the pipes anyway.
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Thanks Hoovie
The house was built in 1962 and the CH was installed in 1971 ( every part of the instalation has been marked with the date!, do people still do that now?)
So from a novice plumber it looks quite easy to jig the pipes 
As for doubles or singles? I think i'll take advantage of a shorter single convector than the doubles, purely because of the depth
MAny thanks for the replys |
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Stoday
Electricity economics consultant
Joined: 20 Jan 2006
Posts: 3080
Location: Sitting on the Bog
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| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:10 am Post subject: |
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| thescruff wrote: |
A 1200 K1 single panel with fins 4094 btus.
A 1400 ditto with with fins 4777 btus.
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Everywhere else in the construction industry and most plumbing has adopted the metric system.
Except, it would appear, gas fitters who have only partially metricated, using kW for boilers but still thinking in BThUs for rads.
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Hoovie
Devon DIYer
Joined: 27 Jul 2007
Posts: 7773
Location: East Devon
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| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:06 am Post subject: |
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| Stoday wrote: |
| thescruff wrote: |
A 1200 K1 single panel with fins 4094 btus.
A 1400 ditto with with fins 4777 btus.
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Everywhere else in the construction industry and most plumbing has adopted the metric system.
Except, it would appear, gas fitters who have only partially metricated, using kW for boilers but still thinking in BThUs for rads.
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Stoday - I have always thought the tyre industry is the most interesting example - worldwide combining inches and mm for tyre sizes 
_________________
If you have a son, DO NOT name him after a verb ....
"Neil, Standup. Neil, Standup"
"Which is it, man?" |
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D Hailsham
Member
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 60
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| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:42 am Post subject: |
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| You wrote: |
| looking at screwfix, a single panel 600x1200 gives out more heat than the old, still a huge difference in size |
Screwfix "cheat" when they give the output of their own-brand radiators as they are not using the approved British Standard method for determining output. You need to reduce Screwfix's figures by about 10%.
Have a look at Stelrad Elite Catalogue |
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